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Computer crashes when downloading too fast, could it be HD related?
Gnopps Jul-10-02 03:20 PM
Hi everyone!

I have a good internet connection via my university. However my computer usually crashes when downloading from servers that I can get a good xfer rate from. Often when I download with a speed above 500 kb/s the computer locks up, the same thing can happen if I do several downloads at the same time even if they are going slower. What happens is that the screen freezes, I can't do anything and I have to do a hard reboot.
My theory is that my hd somehow can't cope with the information being written and locks up. When rebooting the files I have downloaded that are incomplete usually are intact. I purchased my HD with my computer half a year ago, it is a Maxtor 40gb.

I'm thankful for any ideas on this problem,

Thanks!

/Gustav, Sweden


2. RE: Computer crashes when downloading too fast, could it be HD related?
lbyard Jul-10-02 05:05 PM
In response to message 0
>My theory is that my hd somehow can't cope with the information being written and locks up.

Bad theory, not likely. It's not like a buffer overrun in the days of serial interfaces... The Ethernet card is much faster and is probably a busmaster. And the hard disk is goes much much faster. If it weren’t, the system would throttle the download. It could, however, be a hard disk drive problem if it has a defect, but that isn't the likely cause. Doing a scandisk with a surface scan will dispel that one.

It could be memory or interrupt conflict problem. Larry



3. RE: Computer crashes when downloading too fast, could it be HD related?
Gnopps Jul-11-02 05:10 AM
In response to message 2
> Doing a scandisk with a surface scan will dispel that
>one.
>
>It could be memory or interrupt conflict problem. Larry

This problem first occured a couple of moths ago and if I remember correctly I did a surface scan that turned out ok then. I've been looking other posts at this forum and began thinking that it could be a system conflict. I think the problem never happened before I installed a second network-card. I now use my CNet-card to the internet and my Realtek-card to a second computer sharing my connection. A list of my IRQ shows that they, my graphics card and more are all on IRQ 11. (This message is now in the wrong conference I belive)

IRQ Unit
1 Keyboard
3 COM2
4 COM1
6 Standarddiskettstyrenhet
8 System CMOS/clock
9 Microsoft ACPI-Compliant System
10 MPU-401 Compatible MIDI Device

11 NVIDIA GeForce2 Ti
11 CNet PRO200 PCI Fast Ethernet Adapter
11 Realtek RTL8029(AS)-based PCI Ethernet Adapter
11 VIA USB Universal Host Controller
11 VIA USB Universal Host Controller
11 VIA USB Universal Host Controller
11 VIA AC'97 Enhanced Audio Controller (WDM)

12 PS/2-mouse
13 Mathematicsprocessor
14 Primary IDE
15 Secondary IDE

I've been searching the forum and internet for help in this problem but I can't seem to find the answer. Can they all share IRQ 11? How do I reassign them? To where? There are no free IRQ, or?
I'm using Win 2k

Thankful for any help.


4. RE: Computer crashes when downloading too fast, could it be HD related?
lbyard Jul-11-02 03:47 PM
In response to message 3
10 to 1 that's the problem. I would start by disabling all motherboard resources that you are not using; e.g. serial ports, USB... Larry

5. RE: Computer crashes when downloading too fast, could it be HD related?
Zeno Jul-11-02 06:06 PM
In response to message 4
Here're a few ideas for developing a trouble-shooting strategy to solve your problem. Of course, you'll have to adapt these methods to you're specific situation and discard the ideas that don't apply. First, I agree with Larry that it's very unlikely this problem is related to your Maxtor HD.

A) Checking for resource conflicts in WIN2K:

It's normal for WIN2K to assign a lot of devices to one IRQ number, usually IRQ 9. Resource conflicts are rare in WIN2K, but they're usually very easy to spot. Log in as an Administrator.

1) CHECK YOUR EVENT LOGS: click Start > Settings > Control Panel > Administrative Tools > Computer Management. On the "TREE" window (left) expand System Tools, then expand Event Viewer. Click on the System icon and look for error messages -- circles with a red X. Look in the Source column and see if either of your network cards is listed. If so, right-click on the error line to get a detailed description of the problem and an event number for trouble-shooting.

Also, in the Event Viewer section, click on the Application icon and see it there are any errors associated with web browsers or FTP applications (assuming you're using ethernet TCP/IP).

2) CHECK DEVICE MANAGER: click Start > Settings > Control Panel > System. Click on the Hardware tab, then click on Device Manager and expand the Network Adapters section. Click on each adapter listed and click on the Resources tab. Check the Conflicting Devices list (bottom) and make sure it says "No Conflicts". If you see "No Conflicts" for each network card, you can be virtually certain that you're problem is not related to a WIN2K resource conflict.

B) Checking for "Flow Control" errors and bottlenecks:

From the symptoms you describe, it's possible you're having "flow control" errors and bottlenecks. Depending on the features of your particular NIC, you may have more or less control over your hardware flow control settings. Before you play with your NIC flow control settings, it's usually a good idea to monitor your network interface for awhile to get a baseline view of performance during high-speed downloads.

1) MONITOR YOUR NETWORK INTERFACE: click Start > Settings > Control Panel > Administrative Tools > Performance. In the "TREE" window (left) click on the System Monitor icon. (I assume the System Monitor snap-in has been installed by default. If not, you must install it before continuing.) In the Details window (right-hand panel) Right-click to open a small dialogue box and choose Add Counters...

In the Add Counters dialogue box, open the drop-down menu labeled Performance 0bject. By default it will be set to Processor. Change it from Processor to Network Interface. In the right side of the dialogue box select which ever NIC you need to monitor during a high-speed down load. You have several choices to monitor. I would start out with Packets Received Errors, Packets Received Discarded and Packets Received/sec. Do an appropriate monitoring program for each NIC during a down load to check performance. Create a log you can refer to later.

2) MONITOR YOUR TCP CONNECTION: Once you've monitored the Network Interface, go back to the Add Counters dialogue box and change the Performance Object from Network Interface to TCP. Under TCP you can choose to monitor such items as Connection Failures, Connections Active, Connections Passive, and Segments Received/sec. Again, create a log during the download you can refer to later.

You could also monitor your RAM, but it's probably not related to your download stalls.

3) ADJUST YOUR NIC "FLOW CONTROL" (if possible)

Click Start > Control Panel > System. Click on Hardware tab, Device Manager button, expand Network Adapters, and select your adapter. Click on the Advanced tab and look for the item in the left window that says "Link speed/Duplex Mode". The dropdown menu on the right, labeled "value" will probably be set to Auto. You may have to adjust the settings in this menu to conform with your network. This depends on whether your network is half duplex or full duplex, and how much bit density your NIC can handle. In most situations the Auto setting works best because it can usually adjust for network speed and duplex configurations. But it's worth a look.

You may also want to experiment with lowering your Early Tx Threshold value, also found on the NIC Advanced tab (if supported). Use the Monitoring functions above to see if you can produce any improvemet. Remember to write down your original Tx Threshold value so you can reset it if necessary. Adjusting Tx Threshold is unlikely to resolve your problem, but it's worth a try.

C) Simplify your hardware configuration:

You state that your problems may have started when you installed a second NIC card. There may be a reason for running two NIC cards at the same time, but if possible I would think through your situation and see if you can make all of your network connections using only one.

You may NEED two NICs, if you are connecting to two incompatible network stacks, or if you are using your PC as a Bridge/Router between incompatible network segments. If this is not the case, then you are probably better off using only one NIC.

D) Check for mutual NIC interferece problems:

1) Let's suppose you NEED to run two NICs for reasons I don't understand. Then you may want to see if they're interferring with each other. The easiest way to do this is to go into the Device Manager and temporarily disable one of the NICs. Then do a high-speed download with the other NIC and see if you still get a lock-up. This strategy will at least help isolate the problem. If the NICs won't work together, maybe one of them will work independently.

2) If you find that one NIC works independently, another possible solution is to create a separate hardware profile where only one NIC has it's drivers loaded. Then you can use that profile for high-speed down loads, and use to your normal hardware profile for all other PC functions.

I hope this will give you some ideas on how to develop your own best strategy.
Best wishes...


6. RE: Computer crashes when downloading too fast, could it be HD related?
lbyard Jul-11-02 07:21 PM
In response to message 5
He is using ICS. Larry

7. RE: Computer crashes when downloading too fast, could it be HD related?
Zeno Jul-11-02 09:47 PM
In response to message 6
Thanks, Larry. Yes, of course, ICS will need two NICs. I seem to have contracted a mild case of foot-in-mouth disease. Still, I think most of the other stuff applies. At least monitor the connection to try and find out why it's crashing.

8. RE: Computer crashes when downloading too fast, could it be HD related?
lbyard Jul-11-02 11:18 PM
In response to message 7
That's good stuff. Obviously, you work with 2000 more than I do. I'm still stuck in the 9x world and wish I weren't. Larry

9. RE: Computer crashes when downloading too fast, could it be HD related?
Gnopps Jul-12-02 04:52 PM
In response to message 8
Well, I disabled all the stuff I don't need on the motherboard but still got crashes. So I disabled the second network card and now it seems to work fine. I've been trying to download as much as possible at the same time I think it is alright now. Now I will figure out a way to get them both to work at the same time.

I want to thank you both. Larry you have helped me before as well and I owe you. Zeno that was really good advice you gave me. Thank you both!

I miss my Amiga.


10. RE: Computer crashes when downloading too fast, could it be HD related?
lbyard Jul-13-02 06:32 PM
In response to message 9
I'd look into broadband router. It is a better solution anyway. Larry

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